Need a TON of rebel and nutral help tomorrow night!!!

[Ekade]

You know I am there for you too Novall. Based on the current situation, I think we need to have huge numbers to pull this off to overcome the spawn campers.

Perhaps we need a distraction element.. a group to go in and PVP with all the imp masters camping the spawn points in order to allow the strike force a chance at the vette.

Of course, that will be very hard as they have access to Master level stuff and we don't.

[TramelRaggs]

Perhaps we need a distraction element.. a group to go in and PVP with all the imp masters camping the spawn points in order to allow the strike force a chance at the vette.

Am I the only one who thinks this sounds like AMAZING fun? Have one Imp spy there to find out when the Corvette launches in, time it, then during one of the launches have 15 guys or so ready to make the jump (we have more than 15 at the site, right?). Make the jump, have 6 engage, the other 9 go full speed for the vette. Slow to attack speed at 900m out and make a kill run. Add voice chat for a fun factor increase.

Hell, I'm excited about it and I won't even be involved.

[Ekade]

Perhaps we need a distraction element.. a group to go in and PVP with all the imp masters camping the spawn points in order to allow the strike force a chance at the vette.

Am I the only one who thinks this sounds like AMAZING fun? Have one Imp spy there to find out when the Corvette launches in, time it, then during one of the launches have 15 guys or so ready to make the jump (we have more than 15 at the site, right?). Make the jump, have 6 engage, the other 9 go full speed for the vette. Slow to attack speed at 900m out and make a kill run. Add voice chat for a fun factor increase.

Hell, I'm excited about it and I won't even be involved.

Yes.. BUT, it is impossible to get that many people to behave in a coordinated manner. It will probably take weeks to develop a good team. I worry that people will lose hope before it ever develops.

[Keer]

Where the hell is the fairness in that or the "balance" in it? There is none. Now the imperials are camping the spawn in points of Kessel waiting for rebs and nutrals to come in so they can kill em. There are alot more imp masters then rebs or privateers at this point, and for every PvP kill a master gets...he earns prestiege points which means that they can pretty much blow up the rebel base in deep space with little to no resistance.

If anyone disputes this...you dont know facts or your an imp who doesnt want to admit the truth

I sure can't answer with experience here. If this is the case then I see even more why you've been trying this quest going on 5 days now.

As for the unbalanced aspect, I can only guess that the Devs saw the huge disproportion of Rebels & Neutrals-to-Imperials Ratio in-game, figured the Imperial players would just get Zerged in space and hooked them up with the skills and advantages to deal with it *shrug* Not justifying it, just guessing based on past SWG combat policies.

Either that or it's just a huge oversight by the Devs.

Or it could be neither and there's some vulnerablility out there that hasn't dawned on anyone yet.

When logic isn't apparent, whatever is left over deserves a wild guess. I guess...

[TramelRaggs]

As for the unbalanced aspect, I can only guess that the Devs saw the huge disproportion of Rebels & Neutrals-to-Imperials Ratio in-game, figured the Imperial players would just get Zerged in space and hooked them up with the skills and advantages to deal with it *shrug* Not justifying it, just guessing based on past SWG combat policies.

Keer, there isn't any artificial imbalance placed in JtL by the Devs. There is one key reason that there are more Imp Master Pilots than Rebel or neutral, and that's the Imperials put in more time than anyone else.

Now, granted I don't know everyone on the game, but I know the big Gorath guys. I have an in with most major guild leaders, be it rebel or imp. Lires was the first Master Pilot I knew (and he did it before anyone in Immortals or "New CRIM" got master), and he got it by staying up til server shutdown the first week of JtL. I started flying with him on day 2 or so, and I got a lot more Delta guys on my buddy list. They were doing the late nights as well. It also helped that Griggs, Lires and I found a bugged spawn one the first day and used it for all it was worth. Then we got a bug that made us invulnerable (we still don't know how it happened and no, we didn't try to make it happen) and we went to Kessel and grinded like there was no tomorrow.

Believe it or not, the Imp specials and droid commands are not much better than what everyone else has. I would much rather have a deep space repair than a nova blast. I would much rather adjust my shields than do 90 more speed. The Imp stuff isn't better, the Imps just got the better stuff first.

[Ekade]

I don't have a problem with the imps getting the stuff first. Due to RL, I simply cannot compete.

I do have a problem when I cannot access content because people who have the luxury of playing 24/7 are controlling the spawn points.

I disagree with the design if it requires you to PVP to become a master pilot. I am a roleplayer, not a PVP'er. I don't have a vast list of PVP buddies I can call upon to help me fight these people.

The casual player shold not be forced to adapt the playstyle of the hardcore 24/7 PVP griefer d00d type. They already get the best of everything else... now this?

[Seret Sajet]

I disagree with the design if it requires you to PVP to become a master pilot. I am a roleplayer, not a PVP'er. I don't have a vast list of PVP buddies I can call upon to help me fight these people.

The casual player shold not be forced to adapt the playstyle of the hardcore 24/7 PVP griefer d00d type. They already get the best of everything else... now this?

NOW you're playing my tune, little lady.

[Novall]

As for the unbalanced aspect, I can only guess that the Devs saw the huge disproportion of Rebels & Neutrals-to-Imperials Ratio in-game, figured the Imperial players would just get Zerged in space and hooked them up with the skills and advantages to deal with it *shrug* Not justifying it, just guessing based on past SWG combat policies.

Keer, there isn't any artificial imbalance placed in JtL by the Devs. There is one key reason that there are more Imp Master Pilots than Rebel or neutral, and that's the Imperials put in more time than anyone else.

Now, granted I don't know everyone on the game, but I know the big Gorath guys. I have an in with most major guild leaders, be it rebel or imp. Lires was the first Master Pilot I knew (and he did it before anyone in Immortals or "New CRIM" got master), and he got it by staying up til server shutdown the first week of JtL. I started flying with him on day 2 or so, and I got a lot more Delta guys on my buddy list. They were doing the late nights as well. It also helped that Griggs, Lires and I found a bugged spawn one the first day and used it for all it was worth. Then we got a bug that made us invulnerable (we still don't know how it happened and no, we didn't try to make it happen) and we went to Kessel and grinded like there was no tomorrow.

Believe it or not, the Imp specials and droid commands are not much better than what everyone else has. I would much rather have a deep space repair than a nova blast. I would much rather adjust my shields than do 90 more speed. The Imp stuff isn't better, the Imps just got the better stuff first.

I spent nights not sleeping between work and work to get 4/4/4/4 in 4 days. Problem though is that I dont have access to large amounts of high lvl pilots to do this mission. I'm happy for Lires if he has nothing else to do in his life other then stay up and master pilot in 1-2 nights. Hell I soloed all but 2 of my own missions up to where I am now...and that included a mission with tier 4 gungoats and 4 tier 5 escorts. I even helped you Tramel the day after I got my first block in tier 4 with one of your missions.

Why would you not want me to be master anyhow as an imperial if I've hired out to you to help you before?

And no matter what anyone says...yes its forced PvP. Maybe not to the people who are pulling the first shot, but it is. To make master you HAVE to go into a PvP zone...therefore making you attackable. I call that forcing in my book. When their arnt any imps at the spawn in....I can usually handle myself pretty well. However with NPC's and PC's hitting me at the same time, its impossiable...and I refuse to stay up til 5am to do a mission.

[TramelRaggs]

Why would you not want me to be master anyhow as an imperial if I've hired out to you to help you before?

I want to say this very loud and clear. I know that things may seem contrary because I keep defending Lires and Co.

I have no problem with Novall advancing. I would like him to attain Master Pilot status and fly his YT-1300 or whatever other ship of his choice.

Now, let me get to where I have a problem. My problem is with people saying that the Imperials are camping spawn points with the specific intent of preventing Rebels from making master pilot. That is not true. There is no secret message board where we get together and talk about all the people we've stopped. There is no conspiracy. You flew into a PvP zone without the skill at PvP as some other pilot had and lost. That was it. There was no massive plan against you.

I was in Kessel today and I saw you 3 times. The first time I saw Davol (who I was with) attack you. You also had an XWing on your tail. I took out the XWing, but I'm not sure if it killed you or Davol did. I tried to get it down as fast as I could.

The second time I saw you was when you said you wanted a 1v1 fight. I was, at that point, grouped with the only other 3 Imperials in Kessel, who were Lires, Davol, and Xispin. You said you wanted a 1v1 ffight and Davol accepted. I told everyone else to stay out of it (as was only fair). I may have even told you that Davol was going to be your opponent. You two faced off and he won.

You came back and I told the guys I was going to go looking for you. I went the wrong way, since you didn't show up as an enemy (my mistake). It as a while until I corrected that mistake and flew back. I flew back to see you in a storm against the other 3. Did they jump you? Yes. Was it wrong? Yes. It showed me something else, though, but I'll get to that later.

I want you to advance. I can imagine that it's frustrating for you not to be able to. It isn't their fault, though. If you have a beef, you have it with SOE, not Delta. There is no way for them to know your intent. I killed a privateer today because he was flying away from me and gaining ground. He turned his ship around and I deemed that as hostile. I made short work of him. Now, maybe he was just coming to see what my ship looked like. Maybe he was going to ask how to name it. Or maybe, as his blaster fire said, he was looking for action. There was no way for me to know and I'm not going to gamble when it could be the third option.

If you can't put a good amount of high level pilots together for this mission, then you'll just have to take the attitude I have towards the DWB or Kryat Graveyard. Ah well, I guess that's just not for me.

One last thing...

I spent nights not sleeping between work and work to get 4/4/4/4 in 4 days. Problem though is that I dont have access to large amounts of high lvl pilots to do this mission. I'm happy for Lires if he has nothing else to do in his life other then stay up and master pilot in 1-2 nights.

It's not quite irony, but do you see the contradiction?

[Novall]

Yeah but in your previous post Tram, you make it sound like nobody else has put in the work except for Lires. I dont mean to be condesending...but to me thats how you make it out to be.

As for the 1 on 1's. Davol sent me a tell right before he got to me that if I wanted to fight give him a /tell. Then sent me another with someone called Wicked something or other who I had already killed 2 times earlier as the ship I was supposed to be facing....then about 2 secs later I was blasted. Xispin also got spaced by me earlier before the Xwing got me. So as for 1 on 1 flying PvP, I consider myself pretty good to be driving a heavy fighter against TIE advanced. When the ratio is 3:1, that speaks for itself.

So far Tram, you and Xispin are the only 2 imps I'm met in Kessel that I deem as "diecent" people. I say Xispin because he's a good dogfighter and he got a /tell after our fight with me telling him how good of a fight it was. Weather or not people are camping the spawn in points really doesnt matter in the scheme of things. All I know is that when I jump in and 3-4 reds are there waiting for me....then the radar speeks for itself. If people want to PvP in kessel 24/7...thats fine by me. I just want to have 30 mins to do my mission and get the hell out.

[Keer]

There is one key reason that there are more Imp Master Pilots than Rebel or neutral, and that's the Imperials put in more time than anyone else..

But, there's more to that key. I don't doubt what you say, but if so then there's more to it than that. There's more Imp masters because they put in the more early time and they can challenge those who come after them, thus making it a harder task. The same can't be said for those who mastered first because they didn't have to fly against other Player Masters.

If you can't put a good amount of high level pilots together for this mission, then you'll just have to take the attitude I have towards the DWB or Kryat Graveyard. Ah well, I guess that's just not for me.

Is this supposed to be the attitude that players have to satisfy themselves with, though? First come, first served, first on the server?

Those other content comparisons (DWB) really don't belong in the discussion because the same obstacles exist for everyone going up against it. But, when Lires, and whoever else did the Master Pilot quest, where were the Rebel Master Pilots in Master Pilot craft challenging them? Even in fun sporting gamesmanship? What good amount of high level pilots did they have to put together to fly against Player Masters and Environment?

If the advantage was gained, as you say, by players who jumped on it before anyone else, then "oh well, it's not for you" isn't any consolation that I'd want to have someone tell me or that I'd want to tell another player unless I went through his same situation and overcame it.

[Dib]

Ekade and co., you'll like this:

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/boar ... 99#M417399

PvE Master

[Ekade]

Wow.. they responded quickly. People must have been raising holy hell.