Ok so you like NGE...

[Isleh]

I wanted to add that sure the CU was fun. Figuring out what template worked with what tactics was intresting.

But we did the same pre CU. We enjoyed the hell out of the doc buffs when we first relized what they did. And slowly we tried out different combinations. Filtered through what worked best and eliminated combinations. Balanced stats went away, min health and action and max mind was the way to go. and slowly, the game lost it's varity.

Then the CU hit and the buff lines went away. They just became portable and went into our inventories. Already we were seeing the elimination of profession combinations. Medic was becomming a necessity. Doctor even better.

We were repeating history. So what happens when the players figured the CU out? A CUU? Another slight variation so history can repeat itself yet again?

[Isleh]

Again I didn't get to read you whole post I'll go back when I get a few more minutes and read it and alter this as applies.

Okay, I will wait until can formulate a full reply

[Shensen]

SWG is all about repeating history. The sad fact is that no matter how many nerfs they do, no matter how drastically they change the game, the players will always find ways to maximize their efficiency thereby unbalancing the game. The game will always be in a state of unbalance imo - its just a matter of what you are prepared to deal with and for how long.

[Isleh]

((This is not directed "at" anyone...))

As much as her example may be considered a bad one... consider this:

Your first and only MMORPG is SWG. Suddenly one day you find yourself struggling to use even the basic controls of the same game. There is no apparent or inidicative right way to do something. I can attest to this, I had to ask Saf how to get Noct chat back and other things I learned from hearing people share information.

Who wants to spend time doing that? This community has had to try too hard for too long IMHO. You shouldn't be putting this kind of effort in to enjoyment. You shouldn't be having to work so hard to give things a chance. This is your time to relax when you play a game. Its your time in the day to do something other than worry or "work" on something. Ekade realizes that and moved on, I envy her ability to do so.

This community had its issues but was generally comfortable. Most here hoped that the game would go on just like other aging MMORPGs like EQ, etc. We got denied that right. And so we're veterans of nothing. As a matter of fact the old schoolers are stuttering around as level 80 n00bs. I lose battles simply because of modal chat problems. I am pissed about that, but to be honest that would only be the tip of the iceberg.

I am personally tired of putting an effort in to it. I don't blame Ekade one bit for playing WoW this past month - she hasn't missed a thing. If I had another game I loved so much I would leave and never come back. Unfortunately no other game has gripped me like SWG so here I am painfully trying to find my comfort zone again. People accuse me of being a whiner. You're damn right I'm a whiner. Unless you've paid to keep this site running or put as much time in to the community then you got no right to even tell me to STFU or quit whining.

I look at my "Jedi" holding a T21 rifle while wearing Jedi robes and I want to vomit. I look at the 31 forums on this site and see Jibber Jabber overtaking them all in active posts and I want to cry. But then there's people who say "make the most of it" or "stop whining". Fuck that.

I will make one promise to everyone here, I won't complain about anything twice from this point forward. The next time I find something atrociously broken I am going to bitch about it and that will be the last of it.

SOE and LucasArts deserve exactly what they are getting right now. Some of you are already aware of the reports (which I was made aware of last night) that SOE will not confirm SWG's continued existence past March of next year. If... or more likely when the game gets shut down I will be comfortable in knowing that they did this to themselves. The community did not fail the company the company failed the community.

Jabe

I can't make you like the game. But if running around with a T-21 sickens you, don't use it and don't try to learn how to fight with it. Last night when we were hunting together, I used a flechette pistol 2, 3 times? The rest of the night, it was all saber. I went to the cloner once? Twice?.

If I go against a CL 85 BS Henchman alone and it's seperated from the group, then I just throw up stances and get in a force choke or lightning in. I fight for a while then I fight a retreat until agro breaks. If I go against the same henchmen and he's near ranged, then I throw up saber block and do the same. I fight for a while then retreat. I may get incapped but if I retreat far enough, I won't get DBed.

It may take me 45 min to take out an entire group of BS, but I've almost did it. And not because I died. It's because on my last retreat when I had the Assassian down to half and I was getting ready to go back in, it despawned.

This is my game of chess. This is me selecting what one to take out first. Moving in, hitting as hard as I can and moving out. A direct assault from a CL 82 against 3,4,5, more CL 85+ would be sucide. So I don't. If I get incapped, then i wait for the weakened state to end before I go back in.

If you count just the time that combat music is playing, yeah, combat is short. If you count the time I take watching the mob move and looking for one to move away from the main group, making sure the path I choose to retreat through is clear, combat lasts 45+ min.

[Isleh]

SWG is all about repeating history. The sad fact is that no matter how many nerfs they do, no matter how drastically they change the game, the players will always find ways to maximize their efficiency thereby unbalancing the game. The game will always be in a state of unbalance imo - its just a matter of what you are prepared to deal with and for how long.

Isn't that true of any game?

My point was more along the lines of repeating the same mistakes on the fundamental level. Pre CU, you were dependent on Doc buffs. Post CU, you were dependent on BE buffs.

Sure I didn't have to use BE food, much like I didn't have to get doc buffs with min/min/max HAM pre-CU. But to be most effective, I did.

The same problem repeated in a different way.

[ It wasn't a mitigating factor, it was a deciding factor. if you had Ruby Bliel and I didn't, it wasn't a close fight, it was a beat down. Much like doc buffs. ]

[Jabe Adaks]

I am learning and I am having a better time doing other things than before. PvE is better, PvP is horrific. Yeah I don't like holding a gun but it gets the job done at times I wish my saber would.

I have a hard time with these controls. Even with remapped keys I can not fight as skillfully as I once did because primarily I can't get my specials to go off when I want them to.

When I am in battle and I want to execute a special one of the following can go wrong:

1) I hit something wrong and end up with one of many option screens, community etc now blocking my view entirely. Which then of course I have to close them and by that time I am dead.

2) I ready/hit a special and it doesn't go off. I hit it again and it does fire but didn't before due to lag issues.

3) I hit a special and it doesn't fire, I hit it again assuming its lag but then realize way too late I was low and action and should have been running.

There is so much more to do in so much less time in this system. As a player I will just admit to the fact that I suck. I can't push my character to his limit like I could before. I am incapable of operating the controls in this configuration, which is why I liked this game in the first place over FPS and other play styles.

Personally I find that PvP and high end PvE ends up in hitting your keyboard in a panicked rush. No time for mistakes. The strategy is still partially about making the right moves at the right time but that is directly impacted by your "key smacking" capabilities. My major problem is readying specials while steering with wasd and using my mouse all at once. Seems like I am short by one arm/hand to make that happen.

Jabe

[Sai'nu]

The controls still feel clunky to me as well. But here's another thing that's helped me a little bit. It was trying to figure out what my role is in a group. Mind you I think we're a little more balanced out for solo play now, in certain areas.

For me this is what I feel our jobs are in a group, and thus, why I tend to like the NGE changes.

Jedi appear to be Anti-Ranged. Saber Block and some other stacked specials make this possible. But it is a fast game of checkers to pull off if we want to use that phrase.

Spy appears to be equally good at tanking Ranged and Melee. While Jedi can do ranged (with our robes especially now) they seem to lack when it comes to Melee deffense except battling other Jedi.

Officer. While this is a DD... I consider it support. While they do the AOEs... the DDs should be picking off the aggro that the Officer gets.

BH/Commando. To me these are our DDs. They knock'em over while the rest of us set them up.

Medic... C'mon, we all need heal loving.

I still maintain that NGE is fun. The tactics are very different and I'll concede PvP isn't what it used to be. But I'd rather talk about what I do like here at least.... and that is I think their trying to equal out the professions while designating some specific purpose, either on purpose or by accident, for professions.

[Shensen]

SWG is all about repeating history. The sad fact is that no matter how many nerfs they do, no matter how drastically they change the game, the players will always find ways to maximize their efficiency thereby unbalancing the game. The game will always be in a state of unbalance imo - its just a matter of what you are prepared to deal with and for how long.

Isn't that true of any game?

My point was more along the lines of repeating the same mistakes on the fundamental level. Pre CU, you were dependent on Doc buffs. Post CU, you were dependent on BE buffs.

Sure I didn't have to use BE food, much like I didn't have to get doc buffs with min/min/max HAM pre-CU. But to be most effective, I did.

The same problem repeated in a different way.

[ It wasn't a mitigating factor, it was a deciding factor. if you had Ruby Bliel and I didn't, it wasn't a close fight, it was a beat down. Much like doc buffs. ]

I understand the point you were making. I'm simply agreeing and saying that yes we have repeated history pre CU, CU< and we will again with the NGE and whatever else comes down the road. It will almost always be something different, but the pattern remains.

[Isleh]

I keep saying this and I know I may be anoying people with it but of you are CL 80+, then the vette is the best place ( wish I could find a place for CL 60+ that did the same ). Simply because the cloner is down the hall and you can jump right back in.

My first runs could be summed up as:

clone
clone
GRRRRRRrrrrrrrr.....
clone
clone
clone
clone
hey, that worked!
clone
clone
hey, this and that works well together
clone
clone
hey, this works too. I wonder...
clone
This works
this works too... Damn
clone
Yep, do this and this first
then this
then this
I wonder... oops
clone

[Isleh]

SWG is all about repeating history. The sad fact is that no matter how many nerfs they do, no matter how drastically they change the game, the players will always find ways to maximize their efficiency thereby unbalancing the game. The game will always be in a state of unbalance imo - its just a matter of what you are prepared to deal with and for how long.

Isn't that true of any game?

My point was more along the lines of repeating the same mistakes on the fundamental level. Pre CU, you were dependent on Doc buffs. Post CU, you were dependent on BE buffs.

Sure I didn't have to use BE food, much like I didn't have to get doc buffs with min/min/max HAM pre-CU. But to be most effective, I did.

The same problem repeated in a different way.

[ It wasn't a mitigating factor, it was a deciding factor. if you had Ruby Bliel and I didn't, it wasn't a close fight, it was a beat down. Much like doc buffs. ]

I understand the point you were making. I'm simply agreeing and saying that yes we have repeated history pre CU, CU< and we will again with the NGE and whatever else comes down the road. It will almost always be something different, but the pattern remains.

Ah. okay. I'm not use to someone actually agreeing with me

[Sai'nu]

*grin*

I still think the Vette, in offering me a controlled environment, has made me like the NGE. It's frustrating at first... but you get used to it.... hopefully.

[Shensen]

LOL I so want to do the rebel vette. Can it be done solo just for xp or is a group fairly necessary? Look me up next time y'all head up there and I'd be happy to join you in the cloner.

Do I need anything in order to go? A ticket from somewhere or something?

[Isleh]

I am learning and I am having a better time doing other things than before. PvE is better, PvP is horrific. Yeah I don't like holding a gun but it gets the job done at times I wish my saber would.

I have a hard time with these controls. Even with remapped keys I can not fight as skillfully as I once did because primarily I can't get my specials to go off when I want them to.

When I am in battle and I want to execute a special one of the following can go wrong:

1) I hit something wrong and end up with one of many option screens, community etc now blocking my view entirely. Which then of course I have to close them and by that time I am dead.

2) I ready/hit a special and it doesn't go off. I hit it again and it does fire but didn't before due to lag issues.

3) I hit a special and it doesn't fire, I hit it again assuming its lag but then realize way too late I was low and action and should have been running.

There is so much more to do in so much less time in this system. As a player I will just admit to the fact that I suck. I can't push my character to his limit like I could before. I am incapable of operating the controls in this configuration, which is why I liked this game in the first place over FPS and other play styles.

Personally I find that PvP and high end PvE ends up in hitting your keyboard in a panicked rush. No time for mistakes. The strategy is still partially about making the right moves at the right time but that is directly impacted by your "key smacking" capabilities. My major problem is readying specials while steering with wasd and using my mouse all at once. Seems like I am short by one arm/hand to make that happen.

Jabe

I understand. Actually, when the CU came out, the default was WASD and the way we have it now. You just had the option to go back to SWG classic. However, since I was playing WoW at the time and going back and forth between the two made me MT and mess up with chat, I actually kept the WASD movement and chat settings defaults because it was very simular to WoW.

So when the NGE came out, I saw very little change to my keyboard layout and chat system. The only thing I had to do was arange the new windows and remap chat cut, copy and paste.

The quest window... I have mixed feelings about. I like it, I just wish I could move it.

For Spatial chat, I look for the bubbles and I have a single chat tab the monitors Guild, group, tells, Kreetle and Noct chat. There is a seperate chat tab for each plus one for spatial if I want to follow one more closely.

[Sai'nu]

Vettes, and again this is why I like it, really are soloable by everyone! (disclaimer: Of CL 80 and up) The only exception I can think of is an Artisan/Entertainer has no way of successfully doing the Assassinate mission by themselves.

Of course, it's more fun in a group.

Just got through running one in fact. You don't even need a ticket if someone else does the footwork; just the group. I'll try and post something on Corvette runs in Public for more info though.

[Hashum]

Again I didn't get to read you whole post I'll go back when I get a few more minutes and read it and alter this as applies.

Okay, I will wait until can formulate a full reply

At this point I'm just going to drop it. There is no way you can convince me that the NGE requires more skill or thought then the CU.

Like wise I'm sure there's no argument I can make to convice you that the CU required more thought or skill.

So I'm just going to save my breath and stay out of this thread.