San Andreas receives AO rating

[Illbleed]

http://xbox.ign.com/articles/635/635202p1.html

I'm surprised this has not been posted yet. Apparently, the ERSB have revised San Andreas' Mature rating and changed it to "Adults Only" due to the infamous "Hot Coffee" third party modification. I won't go into details(you can research this) as needless to say it was graphic.

Now we all know that developers like to put "Easter Eggs" into movies and games. This is within the developers right to do so. What the ERSB has just done is bowed to political pressure from one wrinkly ass Senator who has aspirations of the presidency. Although I do believe the inclusion of said material into the final version to be in poor taste, it is prepostorous that any "gaming" board adjust the rating of the games based on a THIRD PARTY modification.!

A disturbing trend is developing in the electronic frontier foks and it's threating to take over our freedoms and stifle innovation. Are game companies responsible for all future modifications or "illicit uses" of their product? Well, according to the Grokster case that was decided in the Supreme Court, the answer is "Yes". It is absolutely ludicrous to ask any company to futureproof their product. Why should Take Two be punished for the actions of a third party that has decided to modify the game? I'm sure that there were nude models in the design of the game, there probably are in every game that portrays realistic humans as the clothing is simply a layer added to the model.

What's all this bullshit about the game getting in the hands of children? Now I'm in agreement that this game and most other "M" game should in no way be in the hands of children. This should be enforced in every retail store(BB being the worst offender) My question is very simple. Where are the parents? Are parents staying informed? Are they spending quality time with their children. Probably not.

/end rant

[Jabe Adaks]

These guys are completely stupid changing the rating for third party mods...

In the mid 90's hacked Nintendo ROMs were going around the internet. Most kids who had any clue what was going on were playing hacked roms featuring super mario bouncing around in a wheelchair or 8-bit wheel of fortune with puzzles like "suck my cock". Where were they then?

Jabe

[Illbleed]

These guys are completely stupid changing the rating for third party mods...

In the mid 90's hacked Nintendo ROMs were going around the internet. Most kids who had any clue what was going on were playing hacked roms featuring super mario bouncing around in a wheelchair or 8-bit wheel of fortune with puzzles like "suck my cock". Where were they then?

Jabe

Exactly. This is a prime example of politicians capitalizing on a flawed public opinon that's largely based on ignorance. News flash. All your elected officials care about is getting re-elected so they can take more money out of your're pocketbook.

It always amazes me how much time and effort our politicians invest in the trivial. Are we concerned about finding Osama or bringing our boys home? Hell, no! Let's rant about a video game. Get real.

Now, can it be argued that the ERSB rating system failed? How just is this decison based on the fact that the modification in quest violates the end user license of the product?
http://www.shacknews.com/docs/press/072005_gta_sa.x

No. It's not fair to simply say that the standards for judging electronic content has failed. After all, the Electronic Ratings board isn't populated with developers and reverse engineers.

[X'an Shin]

http://xbox.ign.com/articles/635/635202p1.html

I'm surprised this has not been posted yet. Apparently, the ERSB have revised San Andreas' Mature rating and changed it to "Adults Only" due to the infamous "Hot Coffee" third party modification. I won't go into details(you can research this) as needless to say it was graphic.

Dude, it's NOT graphic. That's the sad part. The people are fully clothed, clipping through the objects, etc. I haven't seen the animation, but from the screenshots I've seen, I think I had hotter coffee than that when I was a teenager dry-humping my girlfriend through our clothes.

Nevermind that EA's Sims has people slipping beneath the sheets for some loud monkey sex, in the game that shipped (not a mod!).

[Krusshyk]

It's an interesting situation.

The content in question actually was written into the game (if I am reading the article correctly, please let me know if I mis-read that), so why wasn't it submitted to the ESRB in the first place? Whether or not it was intended to be accesible by the end user is kind of a moot point. The point being that it CAN be accessed and, therefore, it CAN be viewed. I am not sure how the whole ESRB rating process goes, but from this one article, it sounds like the company making the game in question submits all of the game content to the ESRB to dick around with and then rate. If it was in the game code, it should have been submitted. THAT part I agree with.

But it raises the question of whether or not a game should be rated on the potential for third part mods. I have no idea on that one...it's kind of a slippery slope.

[Illbleed]

It's an interesting situation.

The content in question actually was written into the game (if I am reading the article correctly, please let me know if I mis-read that), so why wasn't it submitted to the ESRB in the first place? Whether or not it was intended to be accesible by the end user is kind of a moot point. The point being that it CAN be accessed and, therefore, it CAN be viewed. I am not sure how the whole ESRB rating process goes, but from this one article, it sounds like the company making the game in question submits all of the game content to the ESRB to dick around with and then rate. If it was in the game code, it should have been submitted. THAT part I agree with.

But it raises the question of whether or not a game should be rated on the potential for third part mods. I have no idea on that one...it's kind of a slippery slope.

In my opinion, I don't think there was a need to report it to the ESRB in the first place since that part of the game could not be accessed by normal means(ie button mashing on the console or keyboard). In fact I believe most games(back me up on this one X'an)specifically prohibit any modification as it violates the EULA. If this is the case, the ESRB is punishing Take-Two/Rockstar for someone violating their code and breaking the law. The hacker should be the one that should be punished.

[Zannon]

I say that you really can't rate something based on what COULD be done to it. That would be like imprisoning a parent as soon as they are born because their child has the potential of becoming a murderer one day. no one can see the future, and just because something CAN be done, doesn't mean it will be done and a manufacturer shouldn't be held responsible for the actions of people outside of their authority/employment.

[X'an Shin]

I just watched the movie of it, and Illbleed's right, she's full on naked, gets down on her knees, gives him head, and then they do it on the bed. He has his clothes on the entire time.

While I have to say that it is pretty damn graphic, I have to wonder:

1). What % of the population is going to go to the trouble of unlocking it? (PC = hex editor software, PS2 = game save modifier program).
2). This game is rated 17 and older. Are there ANY 17 year olds who haven't seen porn yet?

[Novall]

I just watched the movie of it, and Illbleed's right, she's full on naked, gets down on her knees, gives him head, and then they do it on the bed. He has his clothes on the entire time.

While I have to say that it is pretty damn graphic, I have to wonder:

1). What % of the population is going to go to the trouble of unlocking it? (PC = hex editor software, PS2 = game save modifier program).
2). This game is rated 17 and older. Are there ANY 17 year olds who haven't seen porn yet?

Whats porn?

[Kyanus]

Whats porn?

Well, you see Novall, when a man and a woman (or sometimes two women, or two men, or two women and a man, or two men and a woman, or a goat, or some cheese, or sometimes all by themselves--pretty much anything you can imagine) don't really love each other but just want to get paid to have other people watch them having sex in more places than you thought was possible...

On second thought, maybe you should just search the internet. You're bound to find some. :lol:

[Krusshyk]

Whats porn?

...having sex in more places than you thought was possible...

Like in the back of a Volkswagen?

[Isleh]

I just watched the movie of it, and Illbleed's right, she's full on naked, gets down on her knees, gives him head, and then they do it on the bed. He has his clothes on the entire time.

While I have to say that it is pretty damn graphic, I have to wonder:

1). What % of the population is going to go to the trouble of unlocking it? (PC = hex editor software, PS2 = game save modifier program).
2). This game is rated 17 and older. Are there ANY 17 year olds who haven't seen porn yet?

In other news, Sales of the video game "GTA San Andreas" have skyrocketed...

[Dwilah]

Now I just want to see the porno part. Hubba hubba.

I think that if content got into the game in the first place, it ought to have gotten submitted and the game rated as such in the first place, or edited out. Regardless of how you have to access it, someone put it in there giggling behind their hands knowing that someone would be able to later, even if it's obscure.

I also think that this sort of thing is really, really overhyped... I think I'd be more worried that the game Grand Theft Auto appealed to my kid than finger pointing at the makers. Where I live, they're pulling it from the shelves and there's general sensationalism about "embedding pornography into children's toys." This was actually on the six o'clock news and I wanted to just go UGH. Children's toys. Grand Theft Auto. Right.

[X'an Shin]

I just watched the movie of it, and Illbleed's right, she's full on naked, gets down on her knees, gives him head, and then they do it on the bed. He has his clothes on the entire time.

While I have to say that it is pretty damn graphic, I have to wonder:

1). What % of the population is going to go to the trouble of unlocking it? (PC = hex editor software, PS2 = game save modifier program).
2). This game is rated 17 and older. Are there ANY 17 year olds who haven't seen porn yet?

In other news, Sales of the video game "GTA San Andreas" have skyrocketed...

I think not, actually. Rockstar has officially lowered their quarterly and annual performance expectations because of the AO rating. AO means death in the gaming industry, because most stores won't even carry it.

Now they have to re-print new disks without the content, which means an entire re-submission process, bugtesting, etc. It will be months before the new true M rated versions (sans Hot Coffee) will be on shelves.

I'd buy the AO versions while you still can. Might be worth money some day. Just make sure it still has the AO sticker on it.

[X'an Shin]

Now I just want to see the porno part. Hubba hubba.

http://www.gtasanandreas.net/news/single.php?id=1469

Video at this site. It takes a couple of hours to download (everyone's hitting it)

I think that if content got into the game in the first place, it ought to have gotten submitted and the game rated as such in the first place, or edited out. Regardless of how you have to access it, someone put it in there giggling behind their hands knowing that someone would be able to later, even if it's obscure.

This is a good point, but now Rockstar might be suing the company that makes the software that allows you to unlock it on the PS2. The problem here is that the game, as shipped, cannot play the porn. It's not even an easter egg. You have to access it by hacking the code. I agree that it was probably intentionally left in there to be found, but I still think they have some plausible deniability. You, the user, have to basically violate the User Agreement to access the data.

I also think that this sort of thing is really, really overhyped... I think I'd be more worried that the game Grand Theft Auto appealed to my kid than finger pointing at the makers. Where I live, they're pulling it from the shelves and there's general sensationalism about "embedding pornography into children's toys." This was actually on the six o'clock news and I wanted to just go UGH. Children's toys. Grand Theft Auto. Right.

I agree that it's stupid to refer to GTA (any edition) as a children's toy. Just more intentionally ignorant media bias, so they can fan flames.

But it's being pulled off of shelves due to retail agreements. I think most game retailers get their stock through a retail distributor (even Best Buy and Game Stop), or it's some kind of alliance thing. They're being ordered to pull the stock as they have some sort of agreement with the ESRB, and are obligated to remove it due to the non-accurate rating.

As I posted somewhere else (GGA I think?), if I was a parent, and I was upset that my child who was under the age of 17 (<-- younger than the M rating) saw porn in that game, but was fine with them playing the game as shipped, well, I'd think that I've got some other issues going on that need addressing. It's not even hypocrisy. It's just downright shitty parents who are up in arms over this.

List of things okay for underage kids to do in GTA:

Gang bang drive-by shootings.
Sex with hookers in cars (action tastefully hidden!)
Beating hookers after having sex with them to steal their money.
Murder.
Assassinations.
Grand theft auto and larceny.
Vehicular manslaughter.
R rated language.

But graphic sex? OH NOES THINK OF THE CHILDREN.

Please.