Since there's a lot of sh!@ talking going on...

[Jabe Adaks]

Jabe's definition of "teh pwn":

I can't give you a flat out definition fo teh pwn but I can tell you about someone who is teh pwn and has my respect as such.

teh pwn is someone who can talk shit and be right just about every single time. teh pwn is hated by most but mainly just misunderstood. teh pwn has my respect because teh pwn doesn't talk shit about being teh pwn or the logistics of "pwnership of teh gorath" or noobs in general - teh pwn is a do'er...

When it comes to pwning, teh pwn doesn't talk much.. teh pwn just does. Instead of just talking, teh pwn just goes out and pwns face all over up and down everywhere.. For example:

pwnership of teh gorath
pwnership of teh tales noobs
pwnership of teh soe retardiots

So before anyone talks of being teh pwn, just make sure you can back that sh%@ up.

noobs.

Jabe (not teh pwn... yet)

[Ekade]

My Truth:

- Teh pwn is a lie, there is no such thing
- PvP in MMO's is easy
- duelling is the least significant activity in the universe

[Hashum]

that sounds like the commerical from "What Women Want". Yet it still applies so well.

[Shensen]

My Truth:

- Teh pwn is a lie, there is no such thing
- PvP in MMO's is easy
- duelling is the least significant activity in the universe

I agree completely. There is proof within all MMO's that given the right template and some practice, anyone can be teh pwn. There are quite a few Nyvveck, Ekade, Snado, Elminster templates out there and they all pwn given the right circumstance.


















Besides we all know Toront is teh r3@l pwn.

[Jabe Adaks]

My Truth:

- Teh pwn is a lie, there is no such thing
- PvP in MMO's is easy
- duelling is the least significant activity in the universe

1 and 3 agree... if there was a "pwn", my definition at the top would apply.

As far as #2 is concerned, playing WoW (dumbed down MMO) and FOTM SWG hardly qualifies you to make such a broad generalization.

Jabe

[Shensen]

Why does that not qualify? What other MMO offers as much customization of template? I've played CoH, DAoC, EQ, EQ2, AC, SWG, and the cheesy FPSs like Socom and stuff and none of them offer as much choice - in most of those games it is more about gear than template. I'd say if you've played SWG along you can qualify any PvP pwn statement, but that's my opinion.

[Ekade]

My Truth:

- Teh pwn is a lie, there is no such thing
- PvP in MMO's is easy
- duelling is the least significant activity in the universe

1 and 3 agree... if there was a "pwn", my definition at the top would apply.

As far as #2 is concerned, playing WoW (dumbed down MMO) and FOTM SWG hardly qualifies you to make such a broad generalization.

Jabe

All of us can drive a car at 70+ miles an hour, in traffic, while changing radio stations, and yapping on the cell phone.

We can do this without even thinking about it.

Why? We can train our brain to take in information and react accordingly.

We look at the road, we steer, we accelerate, we brake. We make ourselves aware of traffic all around us.

It was hard when we were learning, and even a little overwhelming. But with practice it became easy.


What is MMO Combat?

It is looking at a screen, and pressing buttons in response. It is an exercise in timing and decision making.

We need to be aware of the capabilities of our toon and understand the bad things other players can do to us.


WoW and SWG:

In WoW, you have less time to make decisions than you do in SWG. Combat is slower in SWG. A WoW PvPer finds it easy to react to combat in SWG because of it's slightly slower pace.

That aside, they are conceptually the same. You have "bars" to watch, "states" to worry about, and a variety of offensive and defensive abilities.

Roles are more cut and dry in WoW. There is a definate rock-paper-scissors aspect to WoW combat.


Am I qualified to make that statement?

Maybe, maybe not. That question is subjective.


I guess I should ask.. What is particularly hard about PvP in SWG?

[Isleh]

I guess I should ask.. What is particularly hard about PvP in SWG?

Those buttons MOVE! I swear! Honest!

[Hashum]

I guess I should ask.. What is particularly hard about PvP in SWG?

The variables is what makes it hard. There are so many possible template combinations that you can't trust what you see on the screen.

Not only that but then there is an assortment of modifier's that are usable outside of those your template may provide. (food, drink, spices, buffs, etc.) Each having varried effects and filling ratio's that make balancing the correct food bonus to their filling. And finding a ratio between food and drink.

Then once that's done you have further "special" modifiers for specific situations such as fighting a MCM and needing food/drink or skills to counter their attacks which are different from those of a typical combat template which is focused on pure damage.

Next you have your defensive and offensive abilities that have to be calculated based on their rate of consumption of your "bars" while still anticipating what the actions of your foe could impact those.

Combo's obviously you need to time your attacks and use a series of attacks that will benefit you most in the given situation. If in a long battle your most powerful attacks may drain your action or mind so heavily that it will in fact criple you instead of your enemy so you must conserve your action by using timely damaging combo's that are less costly.

State's, when to apply them, when not to apply them. Especially KD and blind.

There's just so many variables in each fight that is what makes PvP hard in SWG. Preperation helps this and the fact that often times people will focus on proven successful templates instead of testing new unproven templates does give you some benefit in preperation but you can just never know.

I won't even get into the variables with equipment and how that can impact these situations.

[snado]

i dont think i said i was "teh pwn"... i just know some good templates =/
theres a temp around that has about 300 melee def if i can member corectly, it has doc heals in it, but if its the one i am thinking bout, its max lvl is 74, but still hurts like hell if they hit you.

[Hashum]

i dont think i said i was "teh pwn"... i just know some good templates =/
theres a temp around that has about 300 melee def if i can member corectly, it has doc heals in it, but if its the one i am thinking bout, its max lvl is 74, but still hurts like hell if they hit you.

Ok, I would like to know what template has 300 melee defense, I have a hard time seeing that.

[Jabe Adaks]

Combat starts with a template that can be bazillion more combinations than WoW. But other than that the challenge of PvP in SWG is a lot of preparation, e.g. knowing game mechanics, food, armor, weapons and knowing the same about your potential enemies.

There's a lot more places to make potential mistakes that will cause you to get pwned. The fact that roles are less defined also makes it harder because you have to anticipate if someone who is tanking (for example) is going to role-shift by pulling out a carbine and kiting. If they do you have to be ready to respond to it.

Saying PvP is "easy" leaves the impression that you are saying it is easy to win. Its not as easy to win for all templates in the game. Just as its not so easy to race a corvette in a pickup truck. Not to mention saying its easy, in a way, is like saying everyone else sucks - which would not be true either.

People get pissed at me in group grind from time to time because I will AoE the lair even if we're down to 4 people. They want the easy XP, I want the challenge (at least on occasion). When we pwn about 8-10 rontos with a group of 4 its a pretty cool feeling when the last one falls.

I guess you need to qualify "easy". Personally I'd rather play hard, barely win or likely lose than to go in knowing I'll likely win. Out of respect for other people who fight well regardless of the effectiveness of their current template - you'll never hear me call it easy.

Jabe

[Jabe Adaks]

i dont think i said i was "teh pwn"... i just know some good templates =/
theres a temp around that has about 300 melee def if i can member corectly, it has doc heals in it, but if its the one i am thinking bout, its max lvl is 74, but still hurts like hell if they hit you.

Ok, I would like to know what template has 300 melee defense, I have a hard time seeing that.

I had 307 on Jabe before I did the Jedi thing and at that time I did pwn like a motherf---er.

Master Swords
Master TKM
Pikeman 4400
Master Brawler
FS Defenses
Some BE Clothes
NO MEDICAL SKILLS

I regret tossing that for Jedi in hindsight.

Jabe

[snado]

i dont think i said i was "teh pwn"... i just know some good templates =/
theres a temp around that has about 300 melee def if i can member corectly, it has doc heals in it, but if its the one i am thinking bout, its max lvl is 74, but still hurts like hell if they hit you.

Ok, I would like to know what template has 300 melee defense, I have a hard time seeing that.

first you take tkm, which gives THE most deffense in the game to my knowledge aside from master deffender
add the deffense trees of all other melee proffs
then add a doc healing tree, if im membering correctly, id have to get ingame and check with my guild leader, master brawler may be part of it

[Hashum]

i dont think i said i was "teh pwn"... i just know some good templates =/
theres a temp around that has about 300 melee def if i can member corectly, it has doc heals in it, but if its the one i am thinking bout, its max lvl is 74, but still hurts like hell if they hit you.

Ok, I would like to know what template has 300 melee defense, I have a hard time seeing that.

I had 307 on Jabe before I did the Jedi thing and at that time I did pwn like a motherf---er.

Master Swords
Master TKM
Pikeman 4400
Master Brawler
FS Defenses
Some BE Clothes
NO MEDICAL SKILLS

I regret tossing that for Jedi in hindsight.

Jabe

Clothing would be the missing factor. I thought you were talking straight template bonuses.