The Anikin Question

[Jerrel]

Well its simple. Is he the the product of the Force or is he the product of Sith experimentation?

Personally I never liked the "virgin birth" thing. To me it's like saying he's Christ-like and being a Christian it just rubs the wrong way with me. And, I know it is just fition and all but hey that how I feel. I'm not saying Lucas is gona got to hell for it, heck I dont even think he is a horrible person for it. I am saying I dont like the use of it.

[Isleh]

I say the Sith.

I like the twist it puts on the story.

[Hashum]

I'm for the Force, after the biological explanation for how a Jedi can communicate with the Force this puts back some of the mysticisim.

[Ekade]

My vote: Other

I'd say he was conceived naturally. Then again, I have this mental block in regards to the whole midichlorian thing.


Here's the thing.. If Anakin was "made" by the Force or the Sith, I'd expect him to be immensely powerful in terms of the Force. He is "strong in the force", but not super-duper extraordinarily strong in the force. Throughout the movies he only proves to be "strong in the force". I get the impression that people like the Emperor and Yoda are stronger.

The Force has no reason to make Anakin, does it? Perhaps the Prophecy has something to do with this.. but we know nothing about the Prophecy. To me, the Force is part of nature, not a sentient entity.

If the Sith were to make him.. why do it in such a risky environment? If I were to invest in such an endeavor, I would make sure that boy was protected and raised to my ideals so he'd be ready to become the Sith Lord he was born to be.

[Hashum]

My vote: Other

I'd say he was conceived naturally. Then again, I have this mental block in regards to the whole midichlorian thing.


Here's the thing.. If Anakin was "made" by the Force or the Sith, I'd expect him to be immensely powerful in terms of the Force. He is "strong in the force", but not super-duper extraordinarily strong in the force. Throughout the movies he only proves to be "strong in the force". I get the impression that people like the Emperor and Yoda are stronger.

The Force has no reason to make Anakin, does it? Perhaps the Prophecy has something to do with this.. but we know nothing about the Prophecy. To me, the Force is part of nature, not a sentient entity.

If the Sith were to make him.. why do it in such a risky environment? If I were to invest in such an endeavor, I would make sure that boy was protected and raised to my ideals so he'd be ready to become the Sith Lord he was born to be.

Well really it's just your mental block. In the Episode I they clearly state he has a higher midiclorian count then even Yoda.

And then in Episode II Obi-Wan states that Anakin probably could have beaten Yoda in a Lightsaber Duel if he practiced more and left his love of cars behind him.

Then in Episode III the Emperor says that Anakin will become more powerful then he or Yoda.

I think the reason he seems "less" powerful is because he acts rashly and gets himself into trouble, he doesn't concentrate (must be a family trait). And then that whole scarred body thing has got to put a dent in your Force power. Less Midiclorian to connect to the force with.

This goes to the point why Obi-Wan beat Anakin using his experience because he wasn't as strong as Anakin in the Force.

[Dasumi]

I think i'm with Hashum on this one.

It is made very clear that Anakin is considered to be powerfull and the midichlorian count is an evidence (and it never took away any myth about the force).
But even his high midichlorian count is just an indicator of the potential he has. But becoming a master and learning how to use oneselfs potential, not just in regards of becoming a jedi master, think of the more real example of martial arts, can take decades, so it's not surprising, that Anakin still seems to be less powerfull than maybe a jedi master with less potential in using the force, but several centuries of experience in doing so.

And, to stay on topic, i've voted for Anakins creation through the force.

One reason is, that it seems far to coincidencial how he is found. Even if the Sith created him, he is found because in Episode 1 some Jedi and a queen needed a place to hide, not because some Sith directed them to Tatooine.
It's a simple (unmanipulated) choice by Qui-Gon that leads them to this planet, and to Anakin, or as Qui-Gon has said, it was the will of the force (which is not necesarrily a sentient being. In my opinion it's "will" is more compareable to karma, destiny, whatever).

Second is the often mentioned inspiration that Lucas took from Joseph Campbells writings and teachings. Virgin birth and its place in mythology is a part of his most well known work, to which, as far as i remember, even Lucas in one or more interviews refered as an inspiration for Star Wars.

Anakin, even much more than Luke, is a savior figure, not just a false prophet of a misunderstood prophecy, as Yoda hints in Episode 3, but a real one, as Episode 6 shows.
He fullfills this prophecy of destroying the Sith and balancing the force.
That, during this process, the Jedi face destruction too, just seems to show, that the force doesn't feel very balanced with just Jedi either.
But i don't want to bring up that discussion here, it's been a constant companion in many Star Wars forums ^^

Das

[Isleh]

I guess I can live with anything other than force conceived...

A goggle search for vitimans and 20 min in photoshop sums it up for me.

http://www.imagedump.com/index.cgi?pick=get&tp=269070

[Jerrel]

I guess I can live with anything other than force conceived...

A goggle search for vitimans and 20 min in photoshop sums it up for me.

http://www.imagedump.com/index.cgi?pick=get&tp=269070

LOL I just pictured an old jedi who feels that the yonger jedi are stronger in the force than him, so he pulls that from his pokect and gulbs down a couple of blue pills and bing he's back on his game.

[Sai'nu]

It is The Force really; Lucas has said as much. Although... there is enough room for budging that we can form our own hypothesis about it as well.

Frank Allnutt actually wrote a book called 'The Force of Star Wars' some time ago and it detailed how closely the original A New Hope film mirrored things from a Christianity point of view.

The allure of this resemblance is in that... even our own religions have mystery to them to us and 'that' is what Star Wars taps into. It was the revealed midiclorian organisms that took that away... So, The Force didn't seem so mysterious anymore. So, in that regard, I like the 'other' opinion myself as well.

[Jerrel]

I also would go with the other option but the reason why I only put two is because I have heard alot of people debating between them and wanted to see what ever one thought here.

It is The Force really; Lucas has said as much.

Yeah Lucas pretty much said the force created Anikin but did he say that no one was behind it manipulating it and wheater it was the light side or the dark. See vauge statments are non-commintal as a maybee...Man I've been ready too much Wheel of Time

[Novall]

Definately made by the force.

If he was made by the Sith, then I think that Palpatine would have been more intereested in keeping him alive in episode I where he said "Wipe them out...all of them." Palpatine DID NOT know about Anikin until he first found out about him when they went to Coruscant to escape the droid invasion.

Anikin's problems lie in himself and with the Jedi order. His entire tenure as a jedi was spent getting beat over the head with "Your the chosen one, your the jedi of the prophecy!" ect. That made him very vain and presumptious. We see this in EP2 after he kills the tuskens. He tells Padme that Obi is holing him back, and that he should and will be the strongest jedi one day. Also in his fight with Obi we see his vanity. "My new empire!" "You will try." "You underestimate my powers!" all of these lines are a testiment to his vanity, especially of his new powers.

This vanity has made him greedy for acknoledgement from the jedi council. He feels that they are keeping him from being what he believes he should be. He also has his own ideals about the Jedi order and their code. We see this in the battle of Mace and Palp where he tells mace that this isnt the way Jedi do things. Perhaps its not the way HE does things...but I'm sure mace is well aware of how the jedi order works since he's the council leader.

Anikin is wraped up in his own ideals and vanity, and palp sees this and uses it to twist his mind into thinking that the Jedi have only kept him at arms length because they are afraid of his power.

just my observations

[Isleh]

Definately made by the force.

If he was made by the Sith, then I think that Palpatine would have been more intereested in keeping him alive in episode I where he said "Wipe them out...all of them." Palpatine DID NOT know about Anikin until he first found out about him when they went to Coruscant to escape the droid invasion.

Anikin's problems lie in himself and with the Jedi order. His entire tenure as a jedi was spent getting beat over the head with "Your the chosen one, your the jedi of the prophecy!" ect. That made him very vain and presumptious. We see this in EP2 after he kills the tuskens. He tells Padme that Obi is holing him back, and that he should and will be the strongest jedi one day. Also in his fight with Obi we see his vanity. "My new empire!" "You will try." "You underestimate my powers!" all of these lines are a testiment to his vanity, especially of his new powers.

This vanity has made him greedy for acknoledgement from the jedi council. He feels that they are keeping him from being what he believes he should be. He also has his own ideals about the Jedi order and their code. We see this in the battle of Mace and Palp where he tells mace that this isnt the way Jedi do things. Perhaps its not the way HE does things...but I'm sure mace is well aware of how the jedi order works since he's the council leader.

Anikin is wraped up in his own ideals and vanity, and palp sees this and uses it to twist his mind into thinking that the Jedi have only kept him at arms length because they are afraid of his power.

just my observations

This is all speculation but do we know when Palp killed his Master and could it have been a plan of his Master's?

And it dosn't have to be:

"Okay.. I thinking REALLY hard about something.... " *BING* Ani's mom is preggers.

It could also be a slight 'push' in the force that set a chain of events in motion that leads to the virgin birth years later.

[Skorixor]

remember the sith cloud everything with lies and deceptions...they tell people want they want to hear, whether it's true or not, it does not matter...what only matters is the end result...

[IagoBoom]

I like Skor's take. Even if the Force created him...Palpy will tell him whatever he needs to get a win.

Technically...even if Palpy or his Sith-pappa created Anni, they'd use the Force to do it.

Lastly, I think the mysteries of SW make it worthwhile. Not knowing this is better than knowing. I still detest midichlorians and knowing the reason some jedi can visit after dying.