Post Combat Upgrade Discussion (split from Expansion Thread)

[Ekade]

The thing is putting yourself in a situation you'll have fun in. Saf and I hit the Ryatt trail the other night and it was a blast. She's a CL 70 and my puny CL 68 self went down to level 4 RP'ing as we went and it was great. Heck we about got ourselves killed but it's the most fun I have had in a long time.

Yeah, that is the sort of experience I am looking for.

As an MMORPG this game is not about what any one person can do, it's about what you as a group can do. And it's more fun when you just let that be.

I know that.. I LOVE group combat. I rarely find it in SWG, and when I do it is not that enjoyable. Maybe it is for the very reasons E-Bo said.. I am a warrior type that does not add much value. Ranged profs do just as much dmg as I do, if not more.. and I am supposed to be a heavy hitter. The end result is that I am left feeling useless. By the time I actually get into range of a mob, it is already dead. Maaaaybe I can get 1 or 2 swings at it.

I guess I am pissed that I have to deviate from Ekade's character concept in order to have fun and be effective in combat the post-CU world.

Heck before the CU all anyone did was complain about solo'ing and no interaction, now you have it and don't want it. I just don't understand.

I never went soloing pre-CU.

I am not saying the CU is a bad thing. I am saying that I am struggling to find my place. Trust me.. I do want to have fun in every facet of this game. I want to RP, I want to PvE, and I want to PvP. Doing all three keeps things fresh and fun.

[E-bo Obi]

I don't know that it is that you don't add value. I believe it is more your perception that you don't add much value.

[Hashum]

I don't know that it is that you don't add value. I believe it is more your perception that you don't add much value.

I agree with you E-bo. Heck even as a Jedi I often times by the time I can get in range the Mob is dead as well in many groups. It just takes a little practice to understand the flow of group PvE with ranged professions.

Frankly in many cases I have to admit I try to avoid it, unless the Melee tank is pulling the targets, which makes it much more enjoyable. It's just finding a good group. I've started adding non-RP players that are good group members to my friends list. I can then send them a /tell see if they have a group going and if I can get in. Then I already know how the group is going to work and what my role will be. I've found this helps a ton. Plus then you can expose them to RP from time to time.

Try contacting a few good friends to group PvE with and maybe throw in some RP, and it may make it feel more natural and enjoyable. Maybe set up something simple like doing a quest, Kashyyk has plenty get a girl or two from temple together and make it an RP scenario. I find often times I enjoy the small group RP related hunts then "grinding" because then it doesn't feel like grinding. it feels like "playing" and that's fun, and that's what we're in this game for.

[Sai'nu]

I don't know that it is that you don't add value. I believe it is more your perception that you don't add much value.

I have to agree with with E-bo here, Ekade. Even as a ranged Master Bounty Hunter (CL 54 right now) I do feel a little disillusioned that I don't add anything to a group; and, yet, when I get in the right group where I know what my roll is... it becomes much more enjoyable.

I believe one tip was... don't group with CL 80s but people more in your CL range. I think you'd find that to some low level players trying to lvl; you might be their savior when doing a lower lvl hunting group.

Also, group size, yes, I feel completely worthless in an eight person hunting group filled with mostly top end Combat Levels... I'm just clicking the 'tap' AoE button to recieve credit on kills in that environment; very little else. However, with just me and say, Isleh, together where she's the heavy hitting CL 80 and I'm only CL 54; I can still assist her and accomplish some things we might not be able to do solo.

I think it's just a matter of finding the groups that your comfortable with adventuring with and basically sucking it up to put RP aside to enjoy the PvE or PvP sometimes. We all love RP here; or we wouldn't be here... but with how CU works and enjoying all the mechanics of it... we sometimes have to step away from it to mesh with our Non-RPers like Hashum said... to experience where we fit in.

Trust me... your template is not crap. The perception you have, like some of mine, only come from some bad experience that are typical of certain situations. Change the conditions a little and I think the fun/excitement level will go up a ton.

[Jabe Adaks]

Ekade just wants to WTFPWN..

Jabe

[Sepiv]

This discussion thread has been really good. I feel like giving things a clean slate to try again. I'm also tempted by some of the discussion to maybe chuck TKM and consider Doc/CM myself since being "wanted" for a group might be what I feel I'm missing. Back when I was a doctor TKM, I felt needed for my ability to buff and revive players, plus contribute some ass-kicking too.

It does seem like I have fewer options for actions to choose from, but I want to give the good Viceroy or Jabe or (non-SD) Zannon the chance to show me the ropes and feel hope again.

I think that might have been part of my problem -- since I've been back I think I've gotten on Gorath like 3 times and seen one or two folks on...and I don't actually do anything, which I should. I should see if I can impose myself on a friend here so I can feel "into it" all over again.

[Viceroy Odantis]

ekade: i promise if you have good gear, as a swordsman you can do good damage if you know how to work your template, if you are being outdamaged I would suggest its either by a rifleman/xx template or someone with much better gear.

If you like instances and such..buy ROTW...that's the whole focus of that planet. Other than that there are: geo caves, warren, DWB, corellian corvett, etc

I don't mean to sound insulting but when you claim these things don't happen, i have to assume you haven't tried them much because i'd like to see you take a group through the DWB and just "ho-hum" it.

The professions in swg have more roles than ever, just give it a try, pick up ROTW if you like instances so much, but just ask sometime and i'll go over your gear with ya and stuff. I'm sure once you get the new system down you'll like it and find your role.

[Ekade]

Ekade just wants to WTFPWN..

Jabe

Damn straight... I want to pwn, wtfpwn, and melt faces.

WoW got me hooked on the idea that kicking butt in PvE and PvP is fun.

[Ekade]

ekade: i promise if you have good gear, as a swordsman you can do good damage if you know how to work your template, if you are being outdamaged I would suggest its either by a rifleman/xx template or someone with much better gear.

It's more an issue of not getting to dmg something as it is dead before I get there.

Unless I am missing something, it is basically land and armor break, then see if you can get a KD in.. then use your 3 heavy-hitting specials, then some of your smaller ones while your cooldowns are cycling or if your action is getting low.

I don't know if I have "good gear". I feel like I do in that I have a couple of the newer swords from Kash. If that is not "good gear", then please direct me to where I can find some.

My armor is not all that great.

If you like instances and such..buy ROTW...that's the whole focus of that planet. Other than that there are: geo caves, warren, DWB, corellian corvett, etc

I bought ROTW and have spend a total of about 3 hours there.

Went to geo caves once pre-CU. Been to the warren a few times. Have not been to the corvette since the CU. What is the reason to go to these places?

I don't mean to sound insulting but when you claim these things don't happen, i have to assume you haven't tried them much because i'd like to see you take a group through the DWB and just "ho-hum" it.

You are right, I have not tried them.

I'd love to go to DWB. I don't know of any groups that go. So I would have to go through a good deal of effort to build a team just to see how it is. Aside from seeing it and the challenge, what is the motivation to go? Are there good drops there?

I guess I am still missing goals. I need goals. In WoW, you go to an intance to get gear and to gear-up your fellow guildies. I am out of touch with that the cool goals are in SWG. Maybe this is what I am lacking.

The professions in swg have more roles than ever, just give it a try, pick up ROTW if you like instances so much, but just ask sometime and i'll go over your gear with ya and stuff. I'm sure once you get the new system down you'll like it and find your role.

As a swordsman I imagine my role is DPS, secondary tank, and pulling aggro off healers.

I do need someone to go over gear and consumables with me. The first few times I asked (this was before you offered your PvP school), no one was willing to help.

[KirtViza]

Well You need to look at why you would go to an instace IN SWG differently then in WoW.

SWG- Player based Economy, Player crafted Items armor ETC.

WoW- Quest based Economy, Everything is looted.except a few things.

You go into instances in SWG for Componets for AS's and WS's to make you weapons armor and such.

In WoW you go their for the parts or recipes.

I personally Hunt NPC bounties inbetween TRYING TO FIND FRIGGIN RP!

But like today Alonzo Wanted some stupid jellyfish Hologram and I said fuck it lets go get it today. So Alonzo,Toront,Aquaria and I went over there killed a bunch of crap go it in like 5 mins and then walked around killing other crap while we were there. Now i did get a big ass axe use or I could sell but I dont even know if it's worth anything. As for gear Aerulai has to be one hell of a AS. I love my armor and I know where im going for all my needs

[Viceroy Odantis]

of course she's good, if she was shitty i wouldn't be seen with her

<3 aerulai


anyway, Since you have ROTW, come with us to Avatar platform. There are rifle loots, TONS of pistol loots, at least 2 melee drops i know of, maybe more, tons of neat decor, and some overall fun fighting..the big center room you have to be ON YOUR TOES.

[Chaar Darkstalker]

even though i like the CU and the new changes there is some things i miss.

I really miss the way coronet and corellia was pre-cu, it was the centra of trade and just landing there and get in line for a buff was so exciting, people duelling all around, people groupng, gearing up, getting buffed and moving out to do various quests and misssions.

I also miss being able to solo monsters and npcs, i had so so so much fun as tkm soloing krayts =)

I think its very boring that ya gotta be grouped to get any exp after a certain level, that is the oposite to how most other mmorpg works, there u mostly get less exp in a group, but it has its advantages too.

Im glad the dots is out of the buisness, before it was too tough in pvp, everyone rich enuff ran around with dot pistols or dot melee weapons =)

I wonder how swg will evolve in the next 3-6 months, i hope for new houses, a crafter luv patch so they cant get attacked, new locations like cloud city and nar shadaar (hoth! lol)

Another thing i miss alot is that you could color your composite armor as you liked, so if you felt for black arms and grey torso leg feet n helmet u could do it in a few clicks.

Theese days swg dont have any center, well maybe MO on dant but i miss that there was one planet whih were the biggest gatherign point like corellia n cnet was, but it has its advantages too so it dont get so laggy =)

[Jabe Adaks]

Coronet is a perfect example of what is wrong with the game... There is no reason for Coronet to exist. Players have shifted to the most unlikely places in SWG like the Dantooine Mining Outpost. The environment does not service the game mechanics. So there is no reason for most of the cities to be around.

We have a combat system that was completely re-written and non-combat professions that center around servicing the combat professions. So where are all the entertainers going and the crafters spamming/selling? Dantooine Mining Outpost! If you think about it, that should be the largest damn city in the galaxy.

There are so many good ideas for fixing the game its not even funny. In the big cities you could put in mission centers where groups could form up on a more "IC" basis. Instead of taking 16 missions they could go on one long mission called a "tour of duty" that paid out at each stop and was either GCW related or just plain hunting related. There would be a huge reward at the end for completing all the stops too. But thats just me, I'm not a game developer - so what do I know.

Jabe

[toront]

Coronet is a perfect example of what is wrong with the game... There is no reason for Coronet to exist. Players have shifted to the most unlikely places in SWG like the Dantooine Mining Outpost. The environment does not service the game mechanics. So there is no reason for most of the cities to be around.

We have a combat system that was completely re-written and non-combat professions that center around servicing the combat professions. So where are all the entertainers going and the crafters spamming/selling? Dantooine Mining Outpost! If you think about it, that should be the largest damn city in the galaxy.

There are so many good ideas for fixing the game its not even funny. In the big cities you could put in mission centers where groups could form up on a more "IC" basis. Instead of taking 16 missions they could go on one long mission called a "tour of duty" that paid out at each stop and was either GCW related or just plain hunting related. There would be a huge reward at the end for completing all the stops too. But thats just me, I'm not a game developer - so what do I know.

Jabe

Yeah. I think it has become clear over time that Dantooine was never meant to be the planet it has become. What happens when you have only one Adventure/High-Level planet that allows player structures? Everyone flocks to this planet, hitting the city cap and lagging out the small little starport. I avoid Dantooine like th plague. However, if the mob of players decides that is where they will group....then that is where everyone goes to get groups.

Raid type missions or tours of duty would be amazing, but I don't see them coming in the near future, if ever. SOE has pretty much decided on its grinding format, and it isn't likely to change. At least the xp is going to remain fast so that the grind doesn't take too long.

To get players back to the NPC cities you need to put some kind of attraction. Personally, I think that all those empty, doorless buildings in every city would be best served as apartments or store fronts. It would be a moneysink for those crafters that have more credits than they knew what to do with, and also a reason for players to start getting back into the NPC cities. Vendor search makes looking for goods pretty simple now. Having a show right by a starport for a 1-hop trip isn't going to be that much of an incentive, however the novelty of finally being able to use the cities as real cities, not just another set of shuttle/med center/cloner/etc. is what will bring the people back to these cities. At least that's what I think it will take

[KirtViza]

Coronet is a perfect example of what is wrong with the game... There is no reason for Coronet to exist. Players have shifted to the most unlikely places in SWG like the Dantooine Mining Outpost. The environment does not service the game mechanics. So there is no reason for most of the cities to be around.

We have a combat system that was completely re-written and non-combat professions that center around servicing the combat professions. So where are all the entertainers going and the crafters spamming/selling? Dantooine Mining Outpost! If you think about it, that should be the largest damn city in the galaxy.

There are so many good ideas for fixing the game its not even funny. In the big cities you could put in mission centers where groups could form up on a more "IC" basis. Instead of taking 16 missions they could go on one long mission called a "tour of duty" that paid out at each stop and was either GCW related or just plain hunting related. There would be a huge reward at the end for completing all the stops too. But thats just me, I'm not a game developer - so what do I know.

Jabe

Yeah. I think it has become clear over time that Dantooine was never meant to be the planet it has become. What happens when you have only one Adventure/High-Level planet that allows player structures? Everyone flocks to this planet, hitting the city cap and lagging out the small little starport. I avoid Dantooine like th plague. However, if the mob of players decides that is where they will group....then that is where everyone goes to get groups.

Raid type missions or tours of duty would be amazing, but I don't see them coming in the near future, if ever. SOE has pretty much decided on its grinding format, and it isn't likely to change. At least the xp is going to remain fast so that the grind doesn't take too long.

To get players back to the NPC cities you need to put some kind of attraction. Personally, I think that all those empty, doorless buildings in every city would be best served as apartments or store fronts. It would be a moneysink for those crafters that have more credits than they knew what to do with, and also a reason for players to start getting back into the NPC cities. Vendor search makes looking for goods pretty simple now. Having a show right by a starport for a 1-hop trip isn't going to be that much of an incentive, however the novelty of finally being able to use the cities as real cities, not just another set of shuttle/med center/cloner/etc. is what will bring the people back to these cities. At least that's what I think it will take

I fully agree with you toront, you hit it on the nail. And I would love to go to coronet and find vendors in apartment type complexs I think that would make this game soooo much better and go above and beyond any MMO out there.